UNKNOWN 0:00

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 0:17

Welcome to another episode, the place where we talk about kids' ministry and take a peek behind the scenes. We try to share a little bit of what we've learned that works for us and some of our failures so you can avoid them. We release a new episode every Friday, and this is your Backstage Pass to see the magic or disaster that happens behind the scenes of our kids' ministry. I'm your host, Gabe Baker, and today I'm joined by Brother Brian Critcher. How's it going? Good. How are you? Good. I said the place where we... Re instead of we, but we're going to leave it there, unedited and raw. So I'm glad that we got you in here before you had to take off back on the evangelistic field. Yeah. So we are going to learn how to do some of these remote. And so we'll still, because I don't know when we'll see you again. Sure. Anyway, I'm glad we got you in here. So what are we talking about today? We are talking about the power of visuals. The power of visuals. So a picture is worth a thousand words. So my dad used to tell me all the time. So my dad taught me a lot about construction when I was a kid. And he's a great teacher. He explained how to do something. But then when he, quote, showed me how to do it, it became extremely clear. And so he would be like, I remember he would be explaining like, at one time he was telling me, this is like a long, I was 14 probably. And he was telling me how to notch out like a way you can notch out a post if you just have like a skill saw, you know, hammer or whatever. Yeah. So he was explaining how to do it. And so I could do that. It would be even better if this was a video podcast, but this is just audio only today. So he was explaining how you can make several cuts and then you can use a claw hammer to chop it out and everything. Anyway, so he was telling me, he's like, let me show you. So he showed me and he did it and it was amazing. Stuck with me forever. I do it all the time now. So a picture is worth a thousand words. So this is also true with like unfamiliar experiences we can hear about or read about like extreme you know circumstances and we can even have the appropriate reaction like oh that's terrible you know or whatever like a bad car accident or something but when you drive up on one when you actually see a really bad like car accident or something like that or worse you experience one yeah it gives you a whole new perspective entirely and so we live this is a something that's not as, uh, like what's, what's the word dark. Uh, but here's another example is we live here in the Pacific Northwest. And so, uh, we can tell people how green it is here, how beautiful it is, but it's hard for someone to really grasp it until they see it in person, or at least, you know, they see a picture of it or something because, and so often I, I, I think that people like, Oh, okay. Yeah, probably. But then they come here and they're like, it's just, it's kind of overwhelming when you're used to like, say Arizona, it's really nice there, but it's all drab. I mean, it's so drab. Their, their lawns are gravel, you know? And so they come here and it's just like overwhelming all the green everywhere and everything. So anyway, that's what we want to talk about today. Yeah. I've, I've heard stories not to belabor that point, but of our, like of our elder who started the church here in Shalison And of course his brother coming up from Louisiana. Oh yeah. And then, you know, just it being such a stark difference. Oh yeah. It's easy to fall in love with something that, you know, it's so much more beautiful than, and I'm not hating on Louisiana. I'm getting ready to head that way. You're getting ready to go there. Be careful. Anyway. Yeah. You know, one thing that came to my mind in regards to visuals, and this is just a practical thing. I, I used to, and I still some, work in real estate and uh oh yeah you know with a listing you know it would it just wouldn't make sense to try and market a house without posting pictures pictures that's the first thing people want to see isn't it they want to see the pictures of it yeah dress isn't good enough yeah they want to see pictures and then even better if you can go and show them right yeah absolutely yeah that's so true yeah because you can yeah you can explain square footage you can talk about the bedrooms you can you know talk about the beautiful siding But they just, yeah, they want to see a picture. Yeah. Yeah. And this whole concept, too, I think also can be boiled down into it's a God thing, actually, because he, you know, God himself is always manifest, you know, manifested himself. Yes. And Jesus Christ is the express image. Yes. Yeah. Well, and we have types and shadows. Yeah. Yeah. That's good. A lot of good stuff. So, just to dive into the outline, I... Excuse me. This is something that I've had this idea for a long time. You know, I've been a youth leader for a million years, you know, and so. Since I was in you, I mean, even before that. So one thing that I feel like I learned early on is that if a concept is too abstract, you'll lose the attention of kids. Yeah. And I put in parentheses or anyone. I do feel like now, obviously, the more mature you're audience the the more you can get away with abstract uh examples and and it can even it can even help i think in some regards but you have to be careful yeah i feel like you had to be careful and i'm not i'm not a preacher so i'm not calling on any preachers you know to do that sure but i just know that like in sunday school if your concept concepts are too abstract kids eyes glaze over because they don't have a clue what you're talking about they don't understand Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes. Right. Yep. And the illustration was he took a long rope, very long rope, and he taped off just maybe about three or four inch section at the end. And he said he had someone pull out the rope all the way down the sanctuary, just this long rope, seemingly forever, maybe 50 feet, and points out this little six inch or three or four inch piece of tape and says, all right, this right here is our life. And the rest of this rope is eternity. Oh, yeah. And, and then, you know, it was such an amazing illustration. It's like, we get caught up with this section, this little tiny section and we forfeit our forever. Oh, that's good. I've used that many times and it's, uh, I remember as a kid and that's why I've used it is it's stuck. And that's an example. Yeah. It's stuck with you as a kid. Yeah. Yeah. That's, oh, wow. That's really good. You know, we did, um, we've done this before and I think you might've been a part of it when we've done it before, but we did it recently too. is the sower and the seed. So that is a somewhat abstract concept. And so we, we did that as that story, but we did it, we acted it out. And I guess in one way you can flip this around and say, well, that's abstract, but we did it where people were doing all the parts. So we had people that were seeds and then we had people come out. And so like, you know, Oh, wow. Yeah. It does, it grabs kids attention and sticks with them and it gives them something also like to, you know, tangible, I guess. Sure. So they can understand what's, what's happening. Yeah. Um, on that note specifically is, is, you know, you're talking about the sower and the seed. Well, that was a parable. Yes. And so Jesus taught obviously many parables. Yeah. And for that purpose, for the purpose, you can relate to the, The kingdom of heaven is like. Because kingdom of heaven is such an abstract. Well, it's not abstract, but it is abstract to our human minds. And so he had to explain it to us. It's like this. Yeah, exactly. This is what it's like. So set the stage. So like I've done this for youth, like with large props. Yeah. It can grab, you know, grab attention. So I remember. Oh, this was really cool. So one time. I. And I had – what did I have? How did I do this? I had a ladder, a step ladder. It was like a 12-foot step ladder. And I put it on – I had it set up on stage. And I don't remember all the lesson, but I remember the props, see? Oh, yeah. Yeah. But I had the ladder up and then I had these delineators down the middle aisle, these long four-foot cones, you know? Yes. I had them down the middle aisle with a rope. And so it was blocked off. And then I had these boxes, a circle of boxes up on the stage or, or, uh, you know, square of boxes. And they were, they were like probably six or seven feet tall and then a square about maybe eight by eight, eight foot by eight foot square on the stage. So I had all these set up before the youth got there. Sure. So the youth arrives and they're already kind of excited because they're like, what is this? You know, what's, what's going to happen? Yeah. And so I had talked about, um, I talked We talked about how Paul talked about the wall, the divided, I hope I don't get this wrong biblically, but I believe it was the Jews and the Gentiles, the wall in the temple. Okay. And then where he talks about that wall being broken down. Right. Partition. Yeah. That partition being broken down where they could basically worship together. And so I was talking about that. I was using that as an example. And so I had those delineators down the middle. And then I I can't remember. I use the ladder somehow, unless I'm getting it confused. I might, the ladder might've been a different time, a different illustration. I can't remember. Cause I remember I had somebody climb up on it, but anyway, um, but in the boxes, um, I had inside of the boxes, there was, I had a young man inside of there and nobody knew he was in there a long time. Nobody knew he was in there. Wow. And so I, he had a cue. And so I was teaching this lesson. This is to the youth, but this would have worked for kids too. But I was teaching a lesson and I was talking about breaking barriers, breaking walls, whatever. And then at the end he busted out of that. Oh man. It just boxes went flying. They were scared, scared the kids to death, you know, but I, I mean, it was an impact, you know, it was like, Whoa, you know? Yeah. And so that was illustration too, but just the stage props in the very beginning got the attention, you know, right off the bat. Cause it was like, Oh, what's this? Right. Yeah. And yeah, absolutely. It creates, uh, an anticipation. Yeah. And like investment. Absolutely. Yeah. Well, and it's, it's even a little bit different than just, um, just the theme. Right. Yeah. So you can have your, your same theme and Well, the kids might get used to it after several weeks. Yeah, because we do them for 16 weeks long. Yeah. Yep. And so it's like, okay, there's something a little bit different going on here. Yes. And so it causes that anticipation, maybe extra focus. Yeah. Yeah. And so I also have like, that's kind of, you know, in the theater world, there's stage props and then there's like handheld props and maybe other kinds. But I have that as another bullet point is just, Props in general, like that are handheld. And so I put a note, imagine preaching a message about the crucifixion with a whip in your hand the entire time. I tell you what, if I'm, if it hasn't happened, I'm about to do it because that is a really powerful illustration. Well, you did, was that you that did the scroll or was that, that might've been brother Joey. You guys have both been here recently. The scroll. I don't think it was me. Okay. I think it was brother Joey. So what he did is we have a, it looks kind of cool. It looks like a scroll. It's made, I think my mom made it actually, but it's got these, it's like made out of cloth and it's got some kind of, I don't know, almost like curtain rods, but they're really, really short. You know, it's like a foot long. Anyway, we got that and I had it all taped already and he wanted it taped to the pulpit where it hung down in front of the pulpit throughout his message. Oh, wow. And I, what was he talking about? He was talking about, it was something like the power of an empty page. Hmm. And then, of course, we had a screen up, too. But he was talking about, you know, something to do with school. I wasn't in there because I was in Sunday school. Yeah, yeah. But so he, you know, and I know you like to use visuals, too. Sure. Both of you guys were Sunday school staff. That's where it comes from. That's exactly where it comes from. And honestly, I don't really see it.

UNKNOWN 15:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:03

I have seen it across different – in different places. But I don't see it as much as I would imagine. What you thought. What I would have thought. And it comes back to the conclusion. Both Joey and I were in Sunday school. Well, I'll tell you something that's funny is last year at Summit, I was there for Kingdom Kids Conference. And I don't remember what night or maybe it was a day service. I can't remember. But Brother Buxton from California, he was preaching. And he asked to borrow a robe from Sunday school. cool. I, I didn't, I didn't get to see the message, so I don't even know what it was about, but he did use a Sunday school robe, a costume. Yeah. So it's like, I was, that's kind of cool, you know, at a conference. Yeah. Oh yeah. I, I, I'll remember this. I know where this is kind of, uh, you know, talking about preaching is a little bit off the subject of Sunday school, but, um, I'll, I'll never forget a message. Um, I heard at no limits conference in, in California, uh, several, several years ago, uh, Caleb Adams was preaching. Um, and he used, I can't even honestly remember exactly what it was he was preaching. I, I want to say it had to do with, um, stages of dominion, if I'm not mistaken. Um, but he had these different, um, set up all across the platform or like probably six or seven, um, uh, like portraits, art, art portraits that were set up on a, like a stand or what would you call that? Like an easel. Yeah. And they were all set up just across the stage. And he would go to each one and describe a certain thing about that portrait that was supposed to be in conjunction with a particular stage of Dominion. Oh, wow. It was just, like I said, I don't remember exactly the points, but I remember that illustration. And it was really good. It was really, really powerful. Yeah, that's good, man. But, yeah. Well, you know, talking about Nolan, You probably have heard this message if you weren't there. I know where you're going. He wants to be out of there. Yeah. And he likened it to us. We're inside the church and we're looking outside and we want to be out of there. And, and then he, oh man, he threw that fish. He grabbed that fish and threw it out. Man. And then he started screaming, Jesus, I can't breathe. I can't breathe. Jesus. And then the, the, what do they call them? The, the guys that help. Oh, like an usher. Yeah. Cadet. Yeah. Cadet is like his personal assistant or whatever comes running out. with a towel or something and they scooped it up and put it back in the water, back in the church. Oh, man. That's awesome. Powerful, powerful message. Now, my question is, did the fish live? Yeah. I don't know. I don't know if it did or not. Did it survive? But that's, you know, some people backslide and they survive. They come back. Sometimes they don't, you know. Right. That's true. That's true. They stayed out too long. Yeah. But yeah, so the props and set the stage props, And all of this is so that, you know, kind of like we talked about with the parables, is so that the kids, they can relate. Yeah. Because we're trying to teach them. And in our Sunday school, we're doing ages five through 11. So we kind of have a little bit of a broad range. We try to target, you know, the middle around eight, you know, eight years old or something. But we're trying to make it to where the five-year-old understands what's happening. Breaking it down. And where it's cool. For the 11-year-old. That's to like drive it home, you know, so that the kids really get it like, oh, that's what happened, you know. And so the last bullet point I have is just some various types of visuals. And so like in preaching, we use title screens in our church all the time. Yeah. And so like when you preach here, I'm always asking you, what's your title? And then I'll try to create some kind of graphic. And I usually will ask like, and you're pretty good about you just provide it. But often if like pastor, he'll, he'll provide it sometimes, but they'll provide a title. And then I'm like, do you have a main text? What's the context? Yeah. So I can get the context at least if, if not from, if you can't provide context, at least give me the, the main text and I can try to figure it out, extrapolate it, you know? Yeah. So, so I'll try to create a graphic that I feel, you know, conveys what the message is going to be about, you know, or communicates what the message is going to be about. Brother De La Garza was here the other night and he had given me a title. Yeah. Get up. That was his title. Get up. And so, and then he gave me the text and I think he gave me context as well. And so I did, it was like a boxing ring, you know, and had some boxing gloves laying on the ground or whatever. He texts me back. Well, I always, you know, try to share the title. So I texted to him, he texts me back. He's like, that's perfect. I was going to talk about boxing. Oh, wow. Yeah. So it was, it was really good. But so that's what we do in the sanctuary. And now we, we are actually about to have screens here in Sunday school. Um, I didn't know that. Yeah. We've had them. We had them a long time ago. We had a projector, but we were actually going to have a kind of a mini video wall. And so we'll start doing stuff like that. Not necessarily titled. We don't preach it in Sunday school. There's a lot you can do with them though. Yeah. Yeah. We can do a lot with it. But then the other thing is like just kind of what we talked about, like stage props, like a king's throne. We just did that just the other day. So the kids walk in and there's a big throne on the stage. It's like, oh, what that about. Sure. That's what's coming up, you know. And then like the whip, you know, or a sword that you hold on, you know. And then I put a note, if you can incorporate the actual use of the prop into the story, that's even better. Right. You know, like, I guess let's go back to the whip example since you might do this for preaching. Sure. Yeah. Let's craft your message. So imagine, I just imagine Imagine that you, okay, let me back up. One of the things, I taught at a children's ministry seminar a while back, or actually, I think this might have been last year, actually, but I was talking about when you speak, I was talking about, I was just listing methods of grabbing kids' attention. And one of the methods is to have something in your hand. We're actually talking about props, but I grabbed a Kleenex box off of a off the platform. Oh yeah. And I, and so I was talking, I think before I said that I grabbed this Kleenex box off the platform and I was just talking and walking back, pacing back and forth. I'm talking. And then I started talking about why, but the thing is, is when I had that, everybody's wondering, what's he going to do with that Kleenex box? Right. What's going on there? What's doing? And I, you know, I don't like the beaten switch, but I was just using it for example. So if it was Sunday school, it'd be something, you know, where I pull out a score, go to score somebody or whatever, you know, something. Sure. But the point was, is that it had everybody's attention. Yeah. You know, and that only, it can only take you so far, a couple of minutes, but still everybody was like, okay, what's going to happen with it? Yeah. What's that for? You know? And so, so imagine like what we talked about, imagine you, you know, you open your message or whatever, and then all of a sudden you, you pull this whip off the pulpit and you're preaching the message and you're carrying this whip around the whole time. And then, and then people start seeing where you're going. Cause you're talking about the crucifixion. Sure. or God's love or whatever, you know, and they see where you're going, but they're like, you still got this whip. And then maybe you get a volunteer. Yeah. You know. Then they're like, oh man, what's going on here? Yeah. And so then when you can incorporate that into the story, you know, and of course we've done, we've done the play many times before of a crucifixion where Jesus is all bloody. You've been the character before. Yes. Where Jesus is all bloody. We use fake blood and everything. And it's, it's impact. I mean, it's, it's like hits you like, Oh man, Jesus died for me. You know, we know this already, but it, it pulls on your heartstrings, but it also, it, it grabs your attention, you know? And so I think with kids, it's even more, you know, it's like, I remember that. And then think of kids that come on the bus and maybe this is their only time. Right. Exactly. And, and I think one thing that's, that's good about, or useful when using props is understanding that the prop in and of itself is not the main message, but it's, it's a driver of what you're saying, right? It's yeah. It's just to, um, It's like the example you said about parables. Right. It's not just about the parable story. Yeah. It's not about the pearl of great price. It's that the kingdom of heaven is like this. Right. That's the whole key is that it's like this. Yeah. And ultimately, it's incredibly impactful if that's the word, if that's the way of using that word. I'm not sure if it's impactful are impacting, one of the two, either way. But, you know, we already said it, but you end up remembering that illustration for years on. I mean, I could, just throughout this podcast, I've already thought about several different illustrations that I remember. There was one time we were doing a, I think I might've been preaching and I had, I believe I had Oh, okay. And so just illustrating the point of David and Goliath. oh yeah this is so much bigger than yeah than him but but it just showed yeah it gives you like oh wow okay yeah yeah because sometimes you know i mean i used to work in construction and so i understand 10 feet oh yeah a lot of people like shaley was on a podcast one time and i say something about the measurements of the wall she's like oh i don't know i don't know so you're not working with yeah so some people don't have a clue like oh 10 feet yeah it sounds big yeah but then when you start doing that it's like oh Yeah. Yeah. He was even taller than that. Whoa. You know. Exactly. Yeah. That's good. Yeah. And I think, so let's bring this back a little bit is one of the things that I know that many of our listeners, there's some that do pretty close to what we do. I don't know that there's any that do just like we do, but I know like Brother Booker and then they do very close to what Same style, same age group, everything. But I know that there's people that do separate classrooms or that are smaller. Maybe they're smaller just because they're doing separate classrooms and they might even be a bigger church than us, have more attendance in Sunday school than us, but their classrooms are smaller situation or maybe a smaller church. And so some people are maybe like, how can I relate this? So here's the thing is we take advantage of this idea. Yeah. And then also on a macro level, we have fully costumed actors. We have sword fights. We got all these props. We have a whole backstage area. We're blessed. I mean, it's awesome. Absolutely. It's basically children's theater is what we got going on.

UNKNOWN 29:03

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 29:03

But the thing is, I remember a lesson a long time ago when I was in Sunday school. And it was separate classrooms. Our class probably had maybe 10 people in it, maybe less. I can't remember. But I remember the teacher, Brother Chuck Mozingo, he taught a lesson about – about Jesus saying, if they don't worship me, the rocks will cry out. Wow. He taught it from the perspective of the rock. Oh, wow. He was the rock. And he was talking about, I hope that they will quiet. I hope that they shut up so that I can cry out. Oh, wow. That stuck with me. Wow. It was powerful. He didn't have a costume. I don't think he even had any props. Sure. But it was the concept. Now, it was an older class. It was a teenage class.

UNKNOWN 29:58

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 29:59

So I guess my whole point is there's all this cool stuff, but let's go back to the whip example. If you're telling the crucifixion, you got a classroom of five or six kids and you just have a whip in your lap. Right. And you're telling the story. Oh, yeah. You can still be dramatic. You can still be impactful, as you said. You can still do all that. You don't have to have a full cast in costume doing sword fights. Right. If you have the ability to do it, do it. Do it. It's so cool. It's fun, too. But if you're like, I can't do all that, you can make it awesome in just a classroom. You really can. A tissue box goes a long way. Oh, man. Yes. Was that you? Did you teach that about a tissue box? Remind me. What are you thinking? Oh, I think it was Brother Aaron. So Brother Aaron, you brought that up, the tissue box. Brother Aaron, years ago, he's in our Sunday school. but years ago, I think it was, I think it was in our Christian school. He had, this is kind of gross, but he got an empty tissue box. And I can't remember for how long, maybe it was a couple of weeks after service, he gathered up used tissues from the, like around the altar. Oh, wow. And put them in this tissue box, you know, and I don't know if I think he picked them up with a tissue or something, you know, but yeah, kind of gross. But, but then he taught a lesson about the power of a tissue box or something like that. And he was talking about the prayers of the saints and the used up tissues. Oh, yeah. That's cool. Yeah, it's really neat. I'll have to ask him about it. I can't say how many times I've used a tissue box as an illustration recently. Just recently, I was preaching about the need to bring your need to the altar instead of, you know, because your need in and of itself doesn't get God's attention, but when you bring your need with you. Oh yeah. Oh, that's good. And then go to him. Yeah. So, so, well, the closest thing I had was either a water bottle or a tissue box. And so, you know, in my opinion, I was like, oh, tissue box probably gets people's attention a little bit better. So, but it's, yeah. Well, and that's actually true too. I don't want to get off topic too much, but that's true too, is like sometimes, obviously the more prepared in Sunday school, the more prepared we are and if we can grab something that's cool and correlates especially for kids but sometimes when you force people to use their imagination like imagine that this tissue box is your need right when you're saying that it it just it's a connect point sure now for people to like okay yeah yeah I can I get it it doesn't have to be you know an actual elaborate or something yeah yeah you can use anything yeah all right so let's just do a recap cap real quick so again if a concept is too abstract you're going to lose people's attention especially kids if your concepts are too abstract and you're and I'm not just talking about there's a lot of abstract you know Bible concepts but sometimes we can get too lofty in our in our presentation or something and it's like the kids are just like what you know so um keep it keep it literal if you can and then set the stage so if you can even going back to the the small classroom idea if you know ahead of time you know just keep keep the same example for simplicity but if you're going to be talking about the crucifixion you can make a big cross or something and like that'll just barely fit in the corner of room so kids walk in like whoa what is that yeah you know big big props guys grabs attention creates that anticipation yeah and then of course props we spent quite a bit of time on that but like the whip or sword or tissue box or a tissue box that's right so and then there's different types of visuals you can use title screens you can use stage props handheld props and then if you can incorporate them into the story especially if you do have actors you know at all or like we've done and this works for smaller classrooms or big. I did this at Summit. I used kids. I have a thing I say is kids on stage is a great way to engage. Oh, yeah. Oh, for sure. That's another totally different avenue. Yeah, and so you get kids on stage and have them hold the whip. Oh, yeah. Getting them involved. Yeah, get them involved. They'll remember that. Oh, yeah. Yeah, for sure. All right, well, we're out time. So I think that's a wrap. Okay. Until next time.