UNKNOWN 0:00

Bye.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

Welcome to another episode of our podcast, the place where we talk about kids ministry and take a peek behind the scenes. I'm Gabe Baker, and this is where we try to share a little bit of what we learned that works for us, and even those failures that didn't work so well, so hopefully you can avoid them. We release a new episode every Friday, and we will attempt to show the magic or the disaster that happens behind the scenes of our Sunday school each week. So I'm your host, Gabe Baker, and today we have Brother Aaron here. Greetings. Hello, everybody. How's it going? Going good. Good. All right. So you want to introduce today's topic? Sure. Today's topic is cramped creativity. Cramped creativity. I was just trying to get some alliteration in there. So people will often say that they are not creative. And in the same breath, they look at others in awe, stating that they are so creative. In fact, I'm often accused of being super creative, but really I'm not. I don't really feel that creative at all. And so we'll talk about that a little bit. But the general view is that some people are blessed, air quotes here again, blessed with creativity, and the rest of us just missed out when God was handing out the creative jeans. All we got were the Levi's. So the premise of what we're planning to talk about here today is that the ingenious creativity that seems so elusive is actually within your reach. Again, we want to provide value, and so that's kind of the goal it's not to beat anybody up mm-hmm and and it's this podcast is not about bragging or anything right in fact I think we're gonna try to talk about at least one failure today we have so many it's hard to pick from them yeah but I guess one of the first things I got a few bullets again and we can just kind of go through if we approach creativity like like I said in that little synopsis if it's some kind of special unattainable gift then I think it's actually kind of almost an excuse. Yeah. It's a way to

SPEAKER_01 2:32

cop out. It is a way to cop out. You view it as, like you said, an unattainable something that you just can't do, and so therefore you don't even try. You just view it as... something that they're doing

SPEAKER_00 2:43

and

SPEAKER_01 2:44

you never say, hey, we

SPEAKER_00 2:44

can

SPEAKER_01 2:45

do that.

SPEAKER_00 2:45

So

SPEAKER_01 2:45

you don't even try.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

Yeah. And if somebody is in the seat that, you know, in the spot and they can, then often we don't try because of that. It's like, well, they got it. They can do it. Yeah. And I think we're going to talk about some of the staffing a little bit, but we can do a lot more than what we think we can. Absolutely. There's a song that I want to learn. and I started I want to learn how to do it on the guitar I don't play guitar at all zero zilch I know I think I know the C chord and I think the D chord because it's really easy and maybe I don't know if I can remember G or not but anyway so I know like just a couple chords and I think I know what string what the notes are on the strings but I want to learn this this one song and so I started now that this failed here not the creativity necessarily so i i fell off the wagon i need to get back on it but i did start i you know youtube i got on youtube and i started i watched how to do the chords and of course you know the big issues dead chords you know dead strings or whatever on guitar and so i was that i was working on that getting blisters and everything this was like you know with two days but but you know i and so i guess that's just an example of like i'm not a guitar player at all, not taking any lessons, not even trying to be a guitar player. Yeah. But this song is like really rocky on the guitar. Yeah. So I want to learn that. And I still do. But I think that anything can be figured out. Absolutely. Absolutely. And it takes, we're going to talk about this too, but it takes, just start doing it. Just start doing it. And stay with it. Exactly. It takes hard work. I do want to acknowledge there are people that are talented. Sure. Okay. I remember a long time ago, Pastor Burgess our pastor, telling me, we were talking about a particular individual that was in our church, they're not in our church now, that was very talented on a particular instrument. I'm trying to be vague, so give it away. And so they were very talented, but they never worked at it. They just came in, walked in, picked up the instrument. And what he said was that they would probably only reach a certain level. Absolutely. Because they're not used to working hard. versus the person that has to like well I mean I'm not there but the person like me that is trying to pick up a guitar doesn't know how it has to work you know I used to a long time ago play drums I haven't picked up a drum stick in a long time but used to play drums and I I wasn't like your brother is a very good drum player very good natural talent and just picked it up natural sense of timing I didn't have any of that but I played minimum two hours a day

SPEAKER_01 5:39

yeah

SPEAKER_00 5:40

and I was I was a teenager. I started working when I was a teenager. Yeah. Construction. And so I was working, but I would get up and I would play. And so two hours a day, sometimes more because I had to work and work hard at it. Yeah. I hear voices. Do you hear voices?

SPEAKER_01 5:57

No, I don't. So on that, I, I really feel that if someone is in that mode to where they just, and I have fallen into this, I've just been blessed with a natural ear and, I at times have our music director will send out a song or even when I was a music director years and years ago I'd hear a song and I'm like oh I can play that and I would literally this is terrible I would listen to a song one time and I would type out the chords because we didn't have all this fancy stuff now unless you bought a book offline it took a couple weeks to get here I would listen to it and type it out and I wouldn't even touch it or look at it or think about it until Thursday night because Because it was, and we didn't get through

SPEAKER_00 7:02

it okay. I heard him on a podcast recently, and he was saying – he was talking about speaking, public speaking. And he said those that are really gifted at public speaking, he said they can wing it. They can walk up to the podium or the pulpit or whatever the environment is. They can walk up and they can wing it. He said they can do really well. And he said those that are really gifted – they'll be in the top 20%. And of course he's on the world stage. And so that's what he's talking about is the world stage. And he said, they'll be in the top 20%. But he said, you take that same gifted person that prepares and doesn't wing it. He said, they're in the top 2%. Easy. And he said, the top 2% rule the world. So true. Yeah. And I thought, man, that's powerful because we have our talents and our niche, you know, or niche, however you want to say it. But if we can just not take it for granted, you know, and I, I'm guilty. I take it for granted. Here's an example. Here's one of my failures. My shortcomings is I can write and I'm, uh, maybe, maybe I'm talented in that. I'm not like just incredible and I need to write a book maybe and try it. I haven't written one, but, but I write these scripts every single week. I write scripts and they're, um, our scripts are not with dialogue and lines. They're bullet-pointed scripts, but they're scripts nonetheless. So here's the thing is I can whip one out. We have practice at 8.30 on Sunday morning. I get here about 7.45 usually every morning. And I can actually whip out a script in that timeframe. But It's not as good as when I sit down and I spend an hour. Saturday. Yeah, exactly. And I spend the time to make the script really good, detailed. Think about it a little bit and give it some time. Especially if it's a week ahead of time, at least. Then when you're thinking about that throughout the day and you see something and you're like, oh, and that reminds you. That'll fit. Yeah, that'll fit. Exactly. Just like, I suppose, just like a message. Absolutely. Preaching. Okay, I do. have a question for you because you're um so those that don't know i'm gonna embarrass aaron a little bit here

SPEAKER_01 9:40

turning

SPEAKER_00 9:41

red already he's our he's our music guy more than that he does he does so much more than that but he's so talented in music um he plays i think every instrument in fact i remember years ago somebody at the school was learning violin they brought their violin because they were trying to figure something out and brother aaron had never touched Oh, man.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

So the few songs that I have wrote, it is tune first.

SPEAKER_00 10:42

Tune first.

SPEAKER_01 10:43

Yes. I will. In fact, I'm not going to play them right now, but I've got notes on my phone and I've got audio clips of me. I'm just going to do one right now. This is not one of them. Of me going, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, two, three, four, da, da, da, da, or whatever. And it's like, it's just this tune dropped in my head. And I've learned if you don't write it It's going to go away. So I typically get tunes first. And then I kind of go from when I was trying to write years ago, trying to write music. Then I would go like the feeling of the song. If it was something slow and dramatic, I try to make the message more deep, more worshipful. If it was more energetic, I try to do it more of a praise style, just engaging and uplifting. But definitely tune first.

SPEAKER_00 11:28

Okay. Well, we heard the da-da-da-da. So this is it, ladies and gentlemen. This is the debut. We're going to come out with a song. Coming. Running out

SPEAKER_01 11:35

November

SPEAKER_00 11:35

1st. Yeah. Yeah. I was curious. I asked that question a long time ago in a music. I was at a music conference several years ago. And a pretty popular guy in Pentecost, unfortunately, has backslid now. But I asked him the same question. And he made me feel good by saying it was a really good question. But he kind of was back and forth for him. Yeah. And so anyway that's just kind of I think that with me I'm not nearly you know musically talented really at all but I think that for me it would be I think it would be tune because I I I like music yeah you've got the ear yeah and I think I would I but then there's I'm really analytical yeah so I could also see the part of me saying you know okay what's this song gonna be about yeah and you know, what, you know, how can I make it rhyme or whatever?

SPEAKER_01 12:41

Yeah. So the people that have like this poem wrote out and they write all these lyrics out and then they tried, I've had people bring things to me.

SPEAKER_00 12:48

In fact,

SPEAKER_01 12:48

like I'm talking like verse, chorus, verse two, chorus, bridge in their mind. They have no tune to it.

SPEAKER_00 12:55

And they just have, they just have lyrics. This has happened

SPEAKER_01 12:57

several times and they're like, Hey, can you put music to this? Well, that's really difficult because you can get the idea of the, from the words of what they're wanting to say, but like the emotional side of it and the, how they, it's just, it doesn't work. I've always had trouble doing that with people. And we've, we've worked together and we've done a few different things, but it's never the same as your own.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

Yeah. Yeah. Well, and that's something that would be interesting. Maybe we'll talk about this on there. Maybe we'll do a live collaboration and write a song. I think we should do that sometime. That'd be kind of cool. So we're getting a little bit off track, but actually with that, I do, I do want to mention this. Several years ago, we did... I think it was a space theme or something. And you did write a song. It wasn't a song that we produced or anything, but you wrote a song and it was like overnight. Yeah. The breath of life. That's what it was. Oh my Lord. Do you remember

SPEAKER_01 13:55

that? I don't remember that.

SPEAKER_00 13:58

Oh, it was, uh, it was hilarious is what it was. It was like this. I don't know. I don't know if it was a rap tune, but we were all sitting in Pastor Burgess's. office and saturday night people should prepare more than that but um pastor was going to help in sunday school he did help in sunday school

SPEAKER_01 14:21

okay it's coming

SPEAKER_00 14:22

back this is when we almost drowned brother keach yeah okay do you remember we had a wet spot in the carpet for weeks four weeks yes um so we tried to down brother keach with uh we waterboarded yes like straight up waterboarding but you wrote he was like okay we'll write a song and so he was like basically just that's That's what he gave you is write a song. So you're over in the corner of the office writing a song while we're trying to figure out some skit. And, and we came up, I remember, I don't remember exactly. I just remember the breath of life, you know, but I don't remember. There's actually a tune.

SPEAKER_01 14:56

Yeah. I'll have to, I'll have to really think. Cause it is coming back.

SPEAKER_00 15:01

Yeah. And so it was kind of, and I guess that's another thing about, you know, is our next bullet point is constraints. Actually, that's on our next one, but we'll skip to it. Yeah. Constraints for script. Absolutely. Well, you were constrained with time. And my

SPEAKER_01 15:15

pastor

SPEAKER_00 15:15

telling me what to do.

SPEAKER_01 15:16

I'm like, yes, sir. Yeah. So constraints absolutely put can seemingly force creativity in some ways, because for example, like a room size, like if you have a, I'm thinking like set design and set up, take down, like if you have to share a room with the school or set up, take down, that can absolutely put constraints on creativity. But I think at the same time, it does force creativity because you you have to be creative in that moment right you have to figure out what works and and solution solution establish uh people to set up take down i mean i remember we were using the fellowship hall in the building before we got this building the metal building school building we had to take up a set down saturday night

SPEAKER_00 15:58

right yeah saturday night we had a crew for like an hour and a half or so yeah it took a long

SPEAKER_01 16:02

time

SPEAKER_00 16:03

i remember yeah it was a crew that came i uh didn't very often have to come i was part of the uh The creation of it. And then we were really blessed to have staff that would take care of it. And I didn't have to be here every time. I was here often, but not every time. And then basically, our whole staff pretty much would, right after Sundays go, we'd start taking down and store it. In fact, we did a pirate theme down there, which we're in right now. We're in a pirate theme. So when we did the pirate theme down there, we actually had, so we bounced back and forth from, because of the storyline that we're doing for the theme, we have pirate ship and Navy ship. Yes. And so we actually had, we had our ship like wall. Yeah. It was like the sidewall in the back of the ship. And then we had like these railings that we clamp on.

SPEAKER_01 17:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 17:05

One rail was a pirate rail and it was like orangish. color yeah and then the same thing for the floor we had uh osb sheeting yeah we would lay down on the carpet one side was painted orange yeah and that was the pirate ship and then like the next sunday or whatever if we were in navy ship those would come out and we lay them on the other side they were painted gray yeah we had painted these big i don't know three inch bolt heads yeah look you know they look like bolt heads on them and that was the navy ship and then we had a different railing like i think it was that chrome silver spray paint yes that we used for the rail and so that was clamped on but yeah so we had to be that was pretty creative

SPEAKER_01 17:46

very creative

SPEAKER_00 17:46

yeah I remember and it was not a very big room I think we made that room feel huge though it felt

SPEAKER_01 17:52

huge

SPEAKER_00 17:53

I remember one Sunday we were coming in and there was a parent it was a visitor and it was a gentleman he came in and he like kind of turned on his heel and walked out quickly and I was like I wanted to catch him I didn't know if something was wrong or whatever so I just I was like, hey, how's it going? Are you taking off? And he's like, oh, I'm going to get my wife. She has got to see this. I was like, oh, okay, cool.

SPEAKER_01 18:22

All right. In fact, this is off subject, but I remember doing youth there and you had mapped out, this is the analytical side of Brother Gabe here. He had mapped out the entire fellowship hall. And I think you did it like a one by one square, right? When we did our mazes. Oh, yes. We tacked up like, what? visqueen or something to the ceiling.

SPEAKER_00 18:42

Yeah. And we

SPEAKER_01 18:43

had mazes and I helped make several of them. And I remember during youth night with fog machines and lights and music blaring, I got lost so many times and I helped build the thing. And it was in that same small room

SPEAKER_00 18:56

and it worked so well. It felt huge. It felt huge. Yeah, yeah. So that's, I guess, just a quick tip. If you're able to, now this is going to ruin your ceiling, so make sure you have permission. Yeah. You'll have tackles. And those probably other ways to do it but we we have done so many different mazes with plastic yeah so you go to Home Depot buy a roll of plastic and cut it into you know we did usually eight feet is what the height of the ceiling was and we did two foot hallways pretty close to that yeah draw it all out and then just tack it to the ceiling yeah and you can make some awesome it was awesome mazes so we haven't done that in a long time it's been a long time of course we don't have any I know. And we can't tack into them anymore. No. I always had a dream of making a mobile maze. That would be awesome. Like where you could change it. Yeah. I have an idea on how to do that, like a grid system on the ceiling. They're patented. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:55

Somebody's

SPEAKER_00 19:55

going to now. Yeah. Somebody's going to get it now. All the thousands of people that listen to this podcast. Okay. We are running out of time quickly. So, creative things and works that you see, you know, I mean, sometimes when we say that we're talking about paintings. or something but I'm talking about like if you see well we kind of talked about music just now if you hear a song if you see a cool set design we like cool set designs here yeah stuff like that or even I would say like let's say like an action sequence in a stage play

SPEAKER_01 20:30

yeah

SPEAKER_00 20:31

when you see this kind of thing and you're just like wow that was incredible it can all be reverse engineered absolutely welcome to my life yes and so Again, I get accused of being creative, and maybe I have some of that in me now. But... I reverse engineer stuff. I'm like, that's so cool. How do you do that? And I try to figure it's like taking a magic trick and trying to figure out how does that work? Yeah. And so I feel like everything can be reverse engineered.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

Everything can. And like, so from my viewpoint with music, again, this is dating myself, but back before you could like, again, buying like full album music sheets and you had to have them shipped to your house and it took forever. You could And just jump on, you know, I don't even know what websites are out there now, but just download the music right away or find it. We had to sit down and like start, pause, start, pause. What chord is that? And figure it out. And I remember so many times, even with the talent that I did and blessed with is I would say things like somebody would mention a song and I would make the statement that is too hard. That song's too hard. I did that all the time. And Pastor Burgess really, through his example, showed me, no, no, no, we're going to break it down exactly what you said, reverse engineer it and we're We're going to take it chord by chord.

SPEAKER_00 21:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:49

If you don't know the chord, figure it out. Look it up online. If you don't know what a, you know, fill in the blank chord is, look it up. Right. And we break things down note by note, chord by chord. And if you do it that way, anybody can do it.

SPEAKER_00 22:02

Yeah. And now that research, like you said about dating yourself, that research is so much

SPEAKER_01 22:07

easier now. It's here. And you can simplify it. You can get on like, I'm not even going to start naming websites, but you can get on some websites that they'll have the simplified chords. You might not. have a fabulous music team that can play all this funky stuff just by hearing it but you can simplify it yeah break it down make it easy and then build from there

SPEAKER_00 22:25

try everything and see what sticks yes so okay another failure here so we did our survival quest thing we just redid it not too long ago but the first time we did our survival quest theme so we're in a metal building upstairs is where our Sunday school is and it was unfair for a long time and we were using it unfinished so meaning there was no carpet there was no sheetrock on the walls it was framing we had lighting and stuff like that but it was basically an unfinished building and we used it for many years like that so we did I used to do a lot of water features and so we did for the survival quest it ended up being pretty cool but we did a full on creek it was like a circular it had an island in the And it was a full-on creek. I put plastic down, just visqueen. It's like six mil plastic from Home Depot, clear visqueen. Put it down, started putting water in, and it started leaking. And somebody came from downstairs and walking through. And again, it was an unfinished building, but still not ideal. No. And they're like, you got a leak. Go downstairs. And sure enough, it was just dumping everywhere. But we didn't give up. Yeah. So we tried again, got it a little bit better. Basically made a continuous run of plastic around. round and then we used on the joint oh what we did is we we put we kind of hit it with a wasn't really a bridge but it was like shrubbery and stuff and we went up with the plastic so there was no water right there you know so we had to seal it off yeah and then okay so we got it to work and then we put in like a few pumps to make it bubble and yeah and i'm climbing up building a tree that's like um i think it was like 12 feet tall so i'm making this tree and i I got a screw gun and I'm up on the ladder. I drop a screw. And imagine like, you know, this slow motion. The screw is turning. Endo, endo, endo. Sure enough, the point goes right in the plastic and it starts leaking. So, third try. Third time's a charm. I got some 15 mil vapor barrier, which is a really thick, heavy-duty plastic. Absolutely. So I got that. It's called – it's by Stego if anybody wants to use it. So I got that and it comes with some Stego tape that you can seal up the seams. There you go. And that one finally worked. It was so difficult. We had to pump all the water out, clean up all the plastic, get a shop back in there, get fans, dry it out.

SPEAKER_01 25:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:38

Oh, man.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

Well, funny thing about that creek too is we – I believe it's the same creek we used at our youth conference. We had only been back – washington for a short time and when other church when you check your child into sunday school they were given a number oh

SPEAKER_00 25:56

in the way for our youth conference

SPEAKER_01 25:57

yes for a youth conference so that way if your kid falls or cries a number will flash on the screen you look and make sure okay that's my kid so you go right take care well church had just started the preacher had just started preaching and the first number popped up boom my wife looks down and it's our youngest right so you're out there in jackson who's little he's just old enough to be in sunday school so like five or six

SPEAKER_00 26:20

okay

SPEAKER_01 26:20

we go out i go out to see what's going on and he's like soaked just so he walked in and another kid pushed him because he wanted to run through and literally shoved jackson into that river that creek and he fell right in

SPEAKER_00 26:33

and poor jackson he's so mild man oh he was so scared and

SPEAKER_01 26:37

embarrassed

SPEAKER_00 26:38

oh man poor guy yeah oh wow that's oh man yeah and i wonder if we had that warning on the check-in information Oh, probably not. Water. All right. Here's the thing is we want to make sure people are getting value out of this podcast. And I guess kind of the lesson part of this, and it's not fun. We want to provide fun stuff too that's easy. And if we've discovered something, and we're not the discovery kings by any chance, but if we've discovered how to do something cool and we can pass it on to somebody to – That's what we want to do. But this is not one of those things, really. This is not one of those, aha, here's how you do it. You push this button and this is how it happens. This is more of a concept and it's basically hard work. It really is. Hard work is, you know, I work hard. I'm not lazy and I kind of despise laziness to a fault. And so I'm not afraid of hard work. And I did a long time ago. I did, I think it was a video of some kind and it was talking about making it great. And I was talking about the way to make something great is you just work. Yeah. You have to put in the work. Absolutely. And ideas are a dime a dozen. Everybody's, and I like ideas and you know, man, if somebody submits an idea to me or tells me about an idea, I'm all for that. So I'm not knocking that. Yes. But, That's the easy part. So I have ideas too, and that's the easy part of it. It's making it happen. Right. That's where you step over into, let me say, the limelight of creativity. Like the awe that I talked about earlier of like, oh, that person is so creative. Yeah. Well, maybe... But maybe also they spent hours and hours of work. Like you have natural talent in music. But there's some things that you do and I've seen you work at it. And whether it's a vocal run or something on the piano or bass, whatever. And so it takes work and effort. And that's what a lot of people want the magic secret sauce. Yeah. And that's the secret sauce right there. That is a

SPEAKER_01 29:18

secret sauce. You know, and maybe it's how I'm wired. Everybody's wired differently. But with me, especially if i'm kind of in that mode to where he said laziness if i'm being lazy yeah or i'm not really feeling it right so we're obviously not supposed to be around by our feelings but if i'm not feeling it i have noticed with me and i'd imagine this is true for a lot of people when it comes to creativity once i just start once i just do it

SPEAKER_00 29:47

yes

SPEAKER_01 29:47

once i begin whether it's a song whether it's i'm not much of a builder but you fill in the blank once you start doing it and you see something begin to develop or you get that lick on the bass or you learn that vocal run or whatever fill in the blank you learn that thing those we mentioned creative juices those for me those start flowing

SPEAKER_00 30:08

yeah

SPEAKER_01 30:09

and I just wanted I want to do more I want to go to the next one right

SPEAKER_00 30:12

there yeah

SPEAKER_01 30:13

and I want to build better and get better so those juices start flowing and so a lot of times all it takes is just just starting

SPEAKER_00 30:19

just just starting yeah you know one of my favorite things to say is motivation is a byproduct of doing. Yeah. And so it's kind of like, you know, you start cleaning and you, you know, you can't stop or whatever. Yes. That's me. Not always, but, you know, but yeah, you start, you're like, oh, I don't want to do this, but then you do it. And then you're like, oh, well, I cleaned the kitchen. Now I'm going to clean the living room. I'm going to clean, you know, wife comes home like, what is going on? Oh, we're going to remodel the house.

SPEAKER_01 30:49

Got a wall taken out.

SPEAKER_00 30:51

Yeah. So motivation is a byproduct of doing it. And I think just kind of like what you said, creativity is. I think creativity is a byproduct of starting. You just start. And okay, last thing. I almost forgot this and we are really running up against the clock. But so for years and years, I had a good friend of mine, still a good friend. I say still because he's not here at our church anymore. He's still in church. He's not here. But he did He did a lot of, he's talented. Extremely talented. So we did space a couple of years ago and we had a, it's 14 foot tall by 40 feet wide banner. And so I got a basic space background that I wanted on it. And then we added, or he, I just was there for moral support. He added some asteroids and I think you have a satellite up in the corner and he made it look awesome. Then we sent it off to get printed. So he's gone. And so I was like, what prompted is we do titles for our screen in church. We do a lot of advertisements in there, you know, just static slides. So I went from basically barely knowing how to open Photoshop and not knowing how to select tools, not even knowing. Coming from like PowerPoint. Yeah. Yeah. Just nothing. And I'm on the computer a lot for work, but not Photoshop. Yeah. like Microsoft documents, you know? Yeah. Yeah. So, um, so I got on YouTube and started doing tutorials. I found a free 40 hour tutorial

SPEAKER_01 33:03

and

SPEAKER_00 33:03

I started working through it. So, um, I'm not an expert, but I will say that just a few months ago or a couple months ago, somebody was here that has been doing Photoshop for a while.

SPEAKER_01 33:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:16

And they saw some of my work and just assumed that I had been doing Photoshop for years. Yeah, said that I had started a month ago and I couldn't believe it. So, and there's still, I, I'm not tuning my own horn. I'm just using this as an example. I just started, I dove into, I still am. Yeah. I try to almost every day, even if it's a short or something, I try to look at something. Yes. And right now we have somebody else that's kind of interested in it. And so it's helping me because, you know, they say teaching is the best way to learn. So it's helping me by explaining stuff and having to, you know, figure some stuff out. So.

SPEAKER_01 33:52

Well, I'll attest to that. to because our titles for our services are... I haven't seen one yet that hasn't fit. Does that make sense? Like whatever pictures, I don't, I don't know nothing about Photoshop, but they, they help lock in the title. Like I remember them obviously because of the service, but I, when I think of the message, I think of the picture.

SPEAKER_00 34:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:15

Right. And it creates that remembrance for me.

SPEAKER_00 34:17

Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, the art of the start, that'd be another podcast, but yeah, you've got to get started and just do it. Um, so, uh, just to recap really quick is number one, it's It's a myth that creativity is unattainable. Absolutely. You can do it. And then when you are thinking of something cool or just trying to come up with ideas, reverse engineer something. Break it down. Break it down. Eat an elephant one bite at a time. Yeah. And then hard work. It takes hard work. And then I like really what you said really, Aaron, is start. Just start. That's the key. Start. Yes, sir. All right. Well, we are over our time. No. So I think that's going to be a wrap right there. You stuck with us this long. Thank you. Thank you. See you on the next one.